Common sense should tell that you should be allowed to defend yourself (or your family) from an attack by all means necessary!
The "stand your ground" laws protect you from prosecution if you hurt, injure or kill your attacker!
After all, if that person did not attack you, you wouldn't have hurt, injured or killed him!
That is supposed to be common sense.
However, common sense is not as common as it should be.
"Stand your ground" DOES NOT MEAN going after someone who "looks suspicious"
Even if you think that person may be "up to no good",
if you don't have evidence, JUST LEAVE THAT PERSON ALONE! Sometimes, a person is just lost!
However, some people are so paranoid about "people up to no good", that they think any stranger is "up to no good" and "needs to be confronted".
In Florida, this one guy who goes by the name of George Zimmerman claimed to be the "neighborhood watchperson".
However, Zimmerman is a racist prick who thinks any African-American walking in his neighborhood is "up to no good"
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-20/news/os-trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-20120320_1_robert-zimmerman-domestic-violence-online-petition
Teontae Ami, who also lives in the Retreat at Twin Lakes community, said very few black teenagers like himself live in the neighborhood.
Teontae, 17, said he and a close friend who is black would sit at the end of a driveway in the evening and felt uncomfortable when Zimmerman would pass them on a neighborhood patrol.
They used to greet him, but he never responded, Teontae said.
"I think he took his job too seriously," Teontae said, referring to Zimmerman's watch patrols. A student, Teontae said his friend was once confronted by Zimmerman, who accused him of stealing a bike.
"I don't want to call it a black thing, but it sure seemed like it," said Teontae, who said the bike was never stolen.
Another neighbor, 55-year-old Frank Taaffe, defended Zimmerman as "not a racist."
Taaffe, a marketing specialist who had been a watch captain with Zimmerman until December, said he may have been "overzealous, maybe," but "his main concern is the safety and welfare of the community."
Overzealous maybe?
It's a lot more serious than that!
What Zimmerman did to Trayvon Martin was a lot more than just "overzealous, maybe"
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2012/03/19/148905661/killing-of-fla-teen-trayvon-martin-becomes-national-story-about-race
"Seventeen-year-old Trayvon Martin of Miami, was walking from a convenience store to the home of a family friend in a gated community in Sanford on Feb. 26th. He was confronted by neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman. Zimmerman called police to report a suspicious person but before police arrived, the two struggled and Zimmerman shot and killed the teenager. Community members are demanding Zimmerman's arrest but Sanford Police say they don't have sufficient evidence to dispute his claims of self defense."
At the Orlando Sentinel, which has extensive coverage, there's a story that notes how — beyond the issue of profiling — "if George Zimmerman didn't break every rule in the book when it comes to Neighborhood Watch programs, he came close. ... Zimmerman was armed. He was alone. And while waiting for police, he somehow got into a fight with the person he thought suspicious. All three of those actions are strongly discouraged by the National Sheriffs' Association, which oversees about 20,000 Neighborhood Watch programs."
Zimmerman, 28, has not been charged with a crime. According to The Associated Press, "in the months leading up to the shooting, [he] had called police numerous times to report incidents.
So, there's NOTHING "stand your ground" about what Zimmerman did to Trayvon Martin.
Martin did NOTHING to threaten Zimmerman, yet Zimmerman considered Martin "suspicious".
And Zimmerman decided to confront Trayvon Martin for "being suspicious". Zimmerman STARTED THE FIGHT with Martin by confronting him. Zimmerman couldn't handle the fight THAT HE STARTED, so he shot Martin and claimed "self-defense" and "standing his ground".
It is NOT self-defense when you confront someone in an agressive manner. And that is not "
standing your ground"
Zimmerman (who is a mix of Latin American and Jewish) already had earlier incidents with African-Americans he considered "suspicious"
Sounds like a paranoid guy with racist tendencies!
A comic being passed around facebook, source unknown
Here's more on the story.
http://news.yahoo.com/trayvon-martin-case-lead-investigator-asked-step-down-231154652--abc-news.html
Martin, who was black, was carrying only a bag of skittles, ice tea and his cell phone, when Zimmerman allegedly killed him on Feb. 26. While Martin's family has repeatedly called for his arrest, Sanford Police accepted and stand by Zimmerman's claim of self-defense.
Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law gives enormous leeway to people like Zimmerman to use deadly force if they feel threatened. Since the law was enacted seven years ago, justified homicides in Florida have jumped threefold, according to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
Twenty states have similar laws, but Florida's is widely viewed as having the broadest application. Courts across the state have been trying to figure out how to grapple with the legislation and the Martin incident is one of several examples that have stirred controversy.
In another ongoing trial, lawyers for Trevor Dooley are using the law to defend him in the death of his neighbor David James. In 2010, Dooley shot James in front of his 8-year-old daughter after witnesses say the two men got into an altercation on a basketball court in Valrico, Fla., when James tried to prevent Dooley from shooing away a teenage skateboarder using the court to practice tricks.
Dooley's attorneys argue that he is protected by Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law and that he shot James in self defense. They argue that mundane neighbor disputes can turn violent.
Cases like this and Martin's have led Florida State Representative Dennis Baxley, R-Ocala, one of the original sponsors of the law, to say that it has been misused.
"There was nothing in this statute ever intended to protect somebody who was pursuing or confronting other people," said Baxley.
Common sense would tell you that!
Zimmerman just confronted someone he thought was suspicious, shot and killed him, and he claimed it was "self defense"?
And the local police believed him?
And it was considered a "stand your ground" incident?
HELL NO!
Not only are the local police idiots for believing Zimmerman was "standing his ground", so are multiple writers at this Radical Left-Wing magazine The Nation!
The writers at The Nation thinks Zimmerman's action means it is time to do away with "Stand your ground laws" nevermind that what Zimmerman did HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH "STAND YOUR GROUND"
The most idiotic example of this confusion at The Nation is Bryce Covert.
http://www.thenation.com/blog/166908/trayvon-martins-killing-and-our-deep-distrust-government
The law that may have emboldened Zimmerman, and that has most definitely shielded him from proper prosecution, is referred to as Florida’s “stand your ground” law. Passed in 2005, it kicked off a wave of similar legislation across the country that expanded the rights of civilians who use lethal force in self-defense, undoing the former requirement that they retreat from confrontation when possible
Again, Zimmerman's action has NOTHING to do with "Stand your ground". He would have confronted Treyvon Martin even if Florida didn't have "stand your ground" laws becuase Zimmerman is a paranoid prick who profiles people and his actions are UNRELATED to "Stand your ground".
But Ms. Covert's idiocy doesn't end there. She expresses her dislike of "stand your ground with this
"it kicked off a wave of similar legislation across the country that expanded the rights of civilians who use lethal force in self-defense, undoing the former requirement that they retreat from confrontation when possible"
"Retreat from confrontation". WHAT WORLD ARE YOU LIVING IN MS. COVERT?
Someone who can OUTRUN YOU can easily slash your face in seconds! Someone who can OUTRUN you can put you in a choke-hold in seconds. And if you try to call 911,
they can knock that phone out of your hands!
And they could EASILY rape someone like Covert, forcing her to a life with STDs and an unwanted pregnancies.
And if Rick Santorum becomes president, you would NOT be allowed to do ANYTHING about your unwanted pregnancies resulting from a rape!
photo from The Nation
Bryce Covert, the lady that wants you to be defenseless against violent criminals
More nonsense from Covert.
The answer to a police force that is slow to respond, has the wrong priorities, or replicates racism is not to abolish it and put the law in the hands of individuals. The answer to an ineffective government is not to do away with it. The answer can only be reform. Because we can’t put these matters in private hands
This was my response that I placed on the comments to Covert's article
stand your ground laws IS NOT ABOUT GOING AFTER "the suspicious"
Stand your ground laws is about DEALING WITH THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT REALITY that the police (no matter how good they are) WILL NOT COME TO SAVE YOU IN TIME!
The police in Norway TOOK FOREVER to stop the Norway shooter last year!
The police DID NOTHING as looters ransacked London in 2011, Athens in 2008, New Orleans in 2005 and Los Angeles in 1992! The police DID NOTHING as the shooters were crazy in Mumbai in 2008!
There's NOTHING right-wing about wanting to defend yourself against serious threats when the police WILL NOT SAVE YOU IN TIME!
In fact, stand your ground laws can PROTECT minorities against hate-crime felons! That was part of the purpose of the Black Panthers, Brown Berets and the American Indian Movement, all about protecting minorities instead of this naive nonsense of "wait for the police to protect us"
There were plenty of similar responses to Covert's naive article on "
we must rely on police instead of standing our ground". Those comments mentioned about police inaction, police brutality, police racism and police sexism.
So Covert followed her naive article with ANOTHER naive article.
http://www.thenation.com/blog/166943/despite-history-brutality-we-must-reform-not-abandon-police
In a piece I wrote yesterday about the killing of Trayvon Martin, I urged America not to turn its back on the government and put the law in private hands. Martin’s killer, George Zimmerman, is an example of how vigilante justice can (and does) go so wrong.
But many who responded felt that my solution—reforming the police force, rather than abandoning it—didn’t give enough airtime to the history of police brutality in this country.
(skipped paragraphs)
Now Covert expressed something SUPER-IDIOTIC
Stand your ground” laws are not an answer. Beyond encouraging vigilantes, they have coincided with a rise in “justifiable homicides.” Florida’s law was enacted in 2005; since 2007 those incidents have doubled. The laws embolden citizens to shoot first and ask later, in large part because they’re no longer required to retreat or try to resolve the conflict before using force. They have also extended the realm of self-defense from someone’s home to the public sphere, and they’ve been used to defend the use of force to protect property, not just personal safety.
That was the case with Joe Horn. Josh Barro pointed out that my first piece didn’t include the fact that the two men he shot were apparently in the midst of a robbery. But Horn’s decision to ignore the orders of the 911 operator and leave his house to take matters into his own hands—which meant shooting both men, killing them then and there—was just as repulsive whether these men had been robbing his neighbor or just standing around. Stealing property doesn’t warrant death. Horn’s actions were just plain wrong.
Look at what I
highlighted in pink! Bryce Covert think it's
"repulsive" and "
wrong" to shoot someone INTRUDING ON YOUR HOME! Bryce Covert think it's
"repulsive" and "
wrong" to shot someone WHO ARE TAKING YOUR STUFF IN YOUR OWN HOME!
In other words, Bryce Covert think "
shooting an actual burglar = confronting some guy who was just walking by".
George Zimmerman thinks"
shooting an actual burglar = confronting some guy who was just walking by"
In other words, George Zimmerman and Bryce Covert (and her fellow radical left-wing lunatics at The Nation) are
seriously lacking in common sense!
This woman (Bryce Covert) wants you to WAIT FOREVER for the police while someone is INTRUDING IN YOUR HOUSE!
Also, if you can't shoot burglars (as Covert wish), guess what!
THERE WILL BE MORE BURGLARIES!
That's why in Canada (the all supposedly progressive and peaceful version of America), burglars are more likely to enter a home IN WHICH THE RESIDENT IS INSIDE than they would in the USA! Why? In the USA, we are more likely to shoot burglars!
http://www.davekopel.org/2A/LawRev/LawyersGunsBurglars.htm
It is axiomatic in the United States that burglars avoid occupied homes. As an introductory criminology textbook explains, "Burglars do not want contact with occupants; they depend on stealth for success." [FN8] Only thirteen percent of U.S. residential burglaries are attempted against occupied homes. [FN9] But this happy fact of life, so taken for granted in the United States, is not universal.
The overall Canadian burglary rate is higher than the American one, and a Canadian burglary is four times more likely to take place when the victims are home. [FN10]
(this is what Bryce Covert wants the USA to imitate)
And what the supposedly progressive and civilized Eruope?
Major European cities have had have
WAY WAY WAY MORE RIOTS than the USA during the 21st century!
Why? Because, the last time we had a major riot in a large USA city (Los Angeles, 20 years ago), many store owners used their shotguns to stop looters! This sent a message to the looters --- rob someone else! It also sent a message to future rioters -- next time, more store owners will be armed! and it also sent a message to many other Americans --- guns are useful in defending property, don't be unarmed in the next riot!
Some might want to bring up New Orleans in 2005, after Hurricane Katrina, when looting went rampant. However, most property owners had evacuated New Orleans before the hurricane, so there wasn't much people to protect the city!
But in this supposedly "regressive, uncivilized USA" how many large-scale riots occurred since 2005? NONE!
In the supposedly "progressive, civilized Europe", how many large-scale riots occurred since 2005? PLENTY!
Since 2005, large scale riots have occurred in Paris, London, Amsterdam, Rome, Madrid, Athens and Moscow, and much much more!
Meanwhile, it has been MULTIPLE DECADES since large-scale riots occurred in major US cities like Houston, Detroit, Miami, New York, Dallas, Atlanta, Washington DC, Philadelphia, Boston, Phoenix, Chicago or Saint Louis. And it has TWO DECADES since the last time Los Angeles had a major riot!
Why? Because in the USA,
you loot, you get shot!
But in the all-so-progressive Europe, LOOTERS DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT GETTING SHOT! Looters don't have to worry about property owner TRULY STANDING THEIR GROUND! So, Europeans riot WAY MORE OFTEN than Americans do!
Now, more idiocy from Ms Covert
The police force—with its ugly history of racism, sexism, and violence—can be made better. That has to be our goal. Because policing citizens is only a job for the government. The alternative, embodied by Zimmerman and Horn, will mean justice for very few.
This is what I wrote in the comment's section!
Reforming the police force takes forever! It requires YEARS of investigations, meetings, etc.
Meanwhile, someone who wants to slash your face (and possibly kill you and your kids) can do so in a few seconds. And they WILL knock that phone off your hands if you even dare to try call 911!
Wait for the police to reform? Might as well wait for eternity!
And not to mention, in those YEARS that it will take to "reform the police", elections will occur, new politicians take over bringing their new cronies to run things, and reform plans are put on hold! That's how "police reform" happen in the real world.
----------
There has been other writers at the excessively pacifist The Nation who demonized "stand your ground laws" over the Zimmerman case.
Those writers include Peter Rothberg, John Nichols and Mychal Denzel Smith! This article is already long enough, so I'll just post how I responded to Smith's article
http://www.thenation.com/article/166887/justice-trayvon-martin
"Stand your ground" laws were NEVER about going after the "suspicious"
"stand your ground" laws are about allowing people to defend themselves by all means neccessary!
What Zimmerman had NOTHING to do with "stand your ground". He claims it does, but he would've been a racist killer regardless of if "stand your ground" exist! Zimmerman's action is NOT related to "stand your ground" and the leftists at the Nation are taking his bait by blaming "stand your ground" for that hate crime!
and
You want to know what "barbaric" is? I'll tell you what "barbaric" is.
Barbaric is forcing people to remain defenseless while they wait for ETERNITY for the police to arrive (and sometimes, eternity is meant to be taken literally because the police don't even bother to show up)
Barbaric is advocating massive defenseless while the police DO NOTHING while looters run rampant. (which is what police REALLY did during in LA in 1992, Athens in 2008, New Orleans in 2005, London in 2011)
I have mentioned those incidents in the following blog posts
This mentioned how the police DID NOTHING during the first few hours of the 2008 Mumbai shootings, 1992 LA riots, 2008 Athens riots, and 2005 New Orleans looting
http://pablowegesend.blogspot.com/2008/12/police-cant-protect-you-everytime.html
This blog post mentioned how the Norway police were TOTALLY USELESS when a white supremacist shooter went bezerk
http://pablowegesend.blogspot.com/2011/07/police-cant-protect-you-everytime.html
this blog post how the London police DID NOTHING the first few hours of the 2011 riots!
http://pablowegesend.blogspot.com/2011/09/police-cant-protect-you-everytime-uk.html
These blog posts totally disprove all this horse manure coming out of Bryce Covert and her allies at The Nation about "stand your ground"
"Stand your ground" is NOT about confronting "the suspicious" like what the paranoid lunatic George Zimmerman did!
"Stand your ground" is about allowing for self-defense, because in the real world, no matter how honorable your favorite police officer,
THEY MIGHT NOT GET THERE IN TIME TO SAVE YOU!
